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Forum List => Technical Support => Topic started by: joebee53 on February 06, 2011, 03:15:21 pm

Title: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: joebee53 on February 06, 2011, 03:15:21 pm
Don't know if you are familiar with this device - ADL GT40, it's relatively new. It's a USB2 box that features phono in and line in/outs plus USB connectivity for recording and playback. I have it set as the default recording device at 24bit 96khz. My MacBook Pro recognizes it and VS also recognizes it and shows input on check level. So I hit record and immediately get the spinning beach ball which never goes away and I have to force quit VS. I have emailed Furutech (makes GT40) tech support but haven't received any reply yet.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 06, 2011, 04:00:40 pm
Hi,

Do you have any other audio recorder app that you can try it with?  You could try it with Audacity, which is a free download:

http://audacity.sourceforge.net/download/mac

The other thing you can do is to capture an Activity Monitor log.  This will give me some idea of where VinylStudio is getting stuck.  To do this:

1.  From the Finder menu, select Go -> Utilities.
 
2.  Launch the Activity Monitor application.
 
3.  Select VinylStudio in the list of programs in the window (these are all the programs running on your machine, including daemons and suchlike, in case that is of interest).
 
4.  Click Sample Process (in the toolbar).
 
5.  After a few seconds, a window entitled 'Sample of VinylStudio' should open.  In that window, click 'Save'.
 
6.  Save the file (it goes in your documents folder, I think, by default) and then email it to me at:

p DOT sanders @ alpinesoft DOT co DOT uk

Do this when VinylStudio is hung of course.  Thanks.

Other things to try are a different cable and / or USB port.  A problem here might be responsible.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: joebee53 on February 06, 2011, 04:26:04 pm
I did try it with Amadeus Pro and got no input level at all but it did not hang. Went back to VS, lowered the sampling rate to 48khz and left the bit rate at 24 and it worked! So it must be a USB issue because I have no problem with 96khz input from my firewire devices. As a control, I am also going to hook up the GT40 to my back up machine, a 2009 white MacBook, 2ghz w/ 4gb ram, and see if it will accept the 96khz sample rate.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 06, 2011, 04:49:04 pm
OK, thanks.  Please keep me posted.  Does this device have its own drivers?  If so, there might be an update available (although I can find nothing at their site).
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on March 03, 2011, 06:07:41 pm
Just a quick update on this.  Furutech kindly provided a loan unit and guess what, it works fine at 96/24.  I tried this on two different Macs, both running Snow Leopard 10.6.6.  The only problem I encountered was some audio distortion on the MacBook, solved by switching to a different USB port.

So what I suggest you do is:
  - try a different USB port and / or cable
  - try a different Mac, if you can
  - try recording in Audacity, and if this exhibits the same fault
  - approach your Furutech dealer for a replacement unit
 
I'd be interested to know how you get on.  We have one other user with a similar problem, and I have asked him to try the same things.  I'll post anything interesting back here.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: joebee53 on March 03, 2011, 06:31:02 pm
Sorry, I didn't get back to you sooner on this. I did get it to work at 24/96 - the trick is to select the GT40 as not only the input device but the output device as well. I have never had that problem with any of my firewire interfaces. A bit quirky, I'd say. But now all is well. Thanks again for your followup.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on March 03, 2011, 06:50:49 pm
OK, thanks.  How odd.  I didn't need to do that.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: joebee53 on March 05, 2011, 03:23:19 pm
Paul,
Will you please detail your exact setup with the GT40, in case I am missing something else.  I ask because I switched the input from phono to line and now I have the same previous problems with 96/24 record and playback. This is getting very frustrating and I am outside of the 30 day return policy window of the retailer I bought the unit from. I have switched out usb cables, used both usb inputs on my MacBook Pro, tried the unit on my backup MacBook and the issues remain the same. I emailed Furutech support yesterday and have not yet gotten a reply. One more thing, does the unit show up in your About This Mac as a USB 2 device with 480mb throughput? Mine only shows up as a USB 1 device with 12mb throughput. Once again, I really appreciate all your help on this.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on March 05, 2011, 04:01:17 pm
Hi,

I just plugged it in and it worked.  I selected it as the input device in VinylStudio's Check Level dialog and left the output device as it was (built-in output).  I didn't check whether it showed up as a USB 2 device.

I think you should ask your retailer to exchange the unit.  If it is faulty (as I believe it is), their 30 day limit does not apply.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: amanka on March 10, 2011, 04:44:25 am
joebee53,

I too just purchased a GT-40 and am having the same problems as you describe.  When I try to record in AIFF with 96/24, specifically when I click 'Record', VS hangs.  I get the spinning rainbow disc and have to force quit VS.  This happens even when both input and output are set to the GT-40.  When I set the AIFF preference to 44/16, it seems to have worked (I have only recently downloaded the demo and started to use it) in that I appear to have files for each side (although I haven't yet figured out what to do with them).

I don't know what you mean about switching from phone to line because my GT-40 has one button (source selection) with phono/line (button in) and USB (button out).  Here is my specific configuration: turntable output to GT-40 input; GT-40 output to pre-amp line in.  USB output of GT-40 into Mac mini.  When I play/record an album, the source button is phone/line (in).  When I play a song from iTunes on the mini, the source button is USB (out).  I have selected the input and output from the 'sound' control panel to be the GT-40.  When I use About this Mac, the GT-40 shows as version 0.01 with 12 Mb/s speed.  The hub itself shows as version 1.0 with the same speed.  The back of the GT-40 is clearly labeled USB 2.0, so there seems to be some inconsistency here.  I am using the USB cable that came with the GT-40.  Did you ever hear back from ADL Furutech?  Since Paul did not post his stats, I'm as puzzled as you are why his seems to work fine, but ours hangs at this setting.  Paul, would you provide us the contact info of your Furutech source?

At any rate, it seems possible both our GT-40s are 'faulty' although it could be an GT-40 hardware/software issue or an incompatibility issue with this software.  My GT-40 has other problems as well, which is leading me to think Furutech ADL didn't give as much thought to the GT-40 working with Macs as it should have.  For example, when I try play songs through the mini, it often causes iTunes to not function properly as well, and I have to go through a host of reboots and settings changes to get it to work.  I will start emailing Furutech as well. 

Aaron
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on March 10, 2011, 12:31:36 pm
Hi,

There does seem to be some systematic problem, yes, but as I say I could not replicate it with the loan unit Furutech sent me.  I tested at both 44/16 and 96/24 without incident.

Could I ask you to do some tests for me?  To whit:

  - try a different USB port and / or cable
  - try a different Mac, if you can
  - try recording in Audacity, and if this exhibits the same fault

I'm particularly interested in the last of these.

I contacted Furutech through their website:

http://www.furutech.com/a2008/contactus.asp?lang=Eng
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: amanka on March 13, 2011, 06:02:13 am
Paul, I tried another USB port and had the same problem.  I don't have another USB2 cable, but this is supposed to Furutech's forte, so I doubt that's the problem.  I did try different software as you suggested.  I hadn't heard of Audacity, so I tried a demo of Sound Studio 4, and it worked fine.  I supposedly records using a 32-bit floating point and only assigns a bit length when saving the file, so that may be the reason it worked, although I'd be surprised if those last 8 bits were anything other than 0.  Aaron
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on March 13, 2011, 11:38:24 am
OK, thanks for the update.  I'm stuck with this because I cannot reproduce the fault on my computers.  I will contact Furutech again to see if anything can be done.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: joebee53 on March 20, 2011, 05:51:39 pm
Paul and Aaron,

I talked to the folks at Music Direct about my problems with the GT40 and they agreed to a return for replacement. I have had the new unit for over two weeks now and have NO issues! Aaron, I would suggest you return the unit for a replacement if that is possible. Also, there is a little switch on the back of the unit that allows you to use either line in, mm or mc (depending on your cartridge). I noticed my second unit was set to line in by default. I also finally received a reply (before the earthquake/tsunami) from Furutech support in Tokyo from someone named Corey. He or she claimed the problem had to be with my PC (their reference) not being USB 2 compatible! Though the GT40 still shows up in About This Mac as only a USB 1.1 device. Definitely poor support for the Mac. Again, I think your best bet is return the unit for replacement. Kudos to you Paul for doing so much to help both Aaron and I troubleshoot this matter! Such support is sorely lacking these days and is much appreciated!
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on March 20, 2011, 06:28:51 pm
Hi Joe,

Many thanks for the update.  I will pass the information on to Furutech.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: amanka on March 22, 2011, 01:58:23 am
Hi Joe, Paul

Yes, I checked the various settings of that switch (MM=Moving Magnet cartridge, MC=Moving Coil; and line). I've been having some intermittent problems with the GT40 while recording.  After about 5-15 minutes of recording, a hum/buzz appears in the recorded file, but I don't hear it while recording.  I went back to my old phono stage and used my preamp output as a line in for the GT40, but still heard the buzz, so I suspect it is the ADC part of the GT40.  I called Music Direct and it agreed to swap it out even though my 30 days has passed.

Regarding the software, I've been playing with demos of VS and Sound Studio.  SS works for any setting, but it's more expensive.  I tried to trick VS into a higher setting by starting at 44/16, waiting a few seconds and changing to 96/24 after it already started.  It crashed out, so that didn't work either. >:(

I never got a response from Furutech, but it doesn't look like I missed much.  I'd bet they didn't do much testing with Macs.  I'll check back in after I get the replacement unit.

Aaron
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: joebee53 on July 16, 2011, 11:13:07 pm
Just noticed this new addendum to the downloadable ADL GT40 USB user's manual on page 25 under the heading of Mac OS - "Do not set the bit and sample rates on the MAC OS MIDI application to 24bit/96kHz. Only set bit and sample rates to 24bit/96kHz on recording software." My original paper user's manual makes no mention of this.

Joe
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on July 17, 2011, 04:34:20 pm
Curious.  Thanks for the update.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: StefanRied on November 22, 2011, 11:54:09 am
I have the same problem. The GT40 appears as USB 1.x

(http://www.stefan-ried.de/temp/GT40-USB-Recognition.jpg)

A USB 2 device should be listed with 480 MBit/sec speed.

If you set the Vinylstudio to 24/96 only one stream (recording or playback) fits into the USB 1 bandwidth. If you run a 24/96 reconding and use the GT40 also for playback through Vinylstudio the USB device hangs reproduceable.

I opened an ticket with the German Furutech Distributor who was very friendly and committed to research the subject with Furutech Japan. If Furutech will not solve this in the next 10 days, I have to give my GT40 back again.

Is anybody seeing the GT40 as USB 2 device in the OSX Lion System profile???
My Macbook Pro is a fresh Lion 10.7.2 installation.

This is not a VinylStudio problem. Any other recording software will crash or hang if Apple's CoreAudio driver has such a bandwidth problem.

Stefan
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on November 22, 2011, 04:31:54 pm
That's very helpful, thank you.  It might be worth trying another cable and / or USB port but I don't hold out much hope.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Furutech on September 12, 2012, 02:18:45 am
Recording instability and USB noise issues with the ADL GT40: The TENOR chip used in the GT40 has a bandwidth limitation of 12Mbps (USB 2.0 full speed operation), and due to this limitation only one I2S input or output can be set for 24bit/96KHz application at one time. Therefore, under this condition, for simultaneous multiple-channel applications other I2S interfaces must be configured at 16-bit/48KHz or 16-bit/96KHz. In other words, when recording it is necessary to set the audio Input on the computer to 24bit/96KHz (PC-Sound application; MAC-MIDI application), but do not set not the audio Output to 24bit/96KHz. The Output should be set to a lower 16bit resolution until recording is done. Then when you want to playback your 24bit/96KHz files through the GT40 you need to reset the output to 24bit/96KHz and reset the input to a 16bit resolution. For further information please refer to the GT40 FAQ page: http://www.adl-av.com/products/usbdac/gt40/
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: StefanRied on September 12, 2012, 08:47:06 am
Hi,

thanks for the explanation.
This background comes really late. And frankly, would have been expected to be in the manual.
I was personally very disappointed about the GT40, because a 24/96 record and monitor use-case is really the default, what I expect to be delivered by a real USB 2.0 interface in the premium class.

Meanwhile, I have a RME Babyface with superior studio sound quality and an external Phone-Stage, even symmetric audio input and output.

The German company RME is more serious about doing USB and Firewire right. Shiny covers and stylish design is totally useless, if the software part of such a product sucks.
Mac users and even PC users should stay away from Furutech and consider RME.

Stefan
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on September 12, 2012, 12:37:24 pm
Thanks for this.  I'm surprised the UK guys didn't tell me when they supplied the loan unit.  Perhaps it wasn't known about then.  

VinylStudio monitors recordings at the same sample rate and bit depth rate as the recording itself, so will trigger this problem.  The best solution, currently, is probably to turn 'Monitor Recording' off although I did have one correspondent (on the Mac) who reported that setting the sample rate and bit depth to 44/16 in Audio Midi Setup clears the problem.  We cannot verify this ourselves, unfortunately.

And, of course, avoiding using any playback functions in VinylStudio while recording.  That's not so good.

We will see what we can do about this in the next release.  It's probably adequate to monitor all recordings / perform all playback at 44/16 (or at least have an option to do so).
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: dif on November 25, 2012, 02:16:12 pm
I know this is an old topic, but it's just been very helpful to me. I'm using the Creative Sound Blaster Surround 5.1 USB on mac, and this was causing VinylStudio to hang when trying to check levels. I could never get to actually record anything.

Looking at the connection information it's the same as the model described here - 12mb/sec max. Looking using the Audio Midi Setup showed that the output was set to 6 channels. Setting both input and output to 2 channels, 24bit has got everything working. This looks like basically the same issue and same solution as for the ADL GT40 USB.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on November 25, 2012, 03:45:26 pm
Interesting.  Thanks for the info.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: GHSMD on December 25, 2012, 12:52:38 pm
First, thanks for your great product!  I second the request to support separate sample rate and bit depth for monitoring vs recording.

For other ADL GT40 users out there,  I can record at 96/24 and do "Save Tracks" editing at 96/16.  Source select USB on the GT40.  After setting Recording Options to 96/24 in VS, check in Mac OS X Audio Midi Setup that device "ADL GT40 USB DAC" shows Input format 96/24 and Output format 96/16.  Change Output back to 96/16 if necessary.  This is contrary to the advice in the ADL FAQ that says to let the recording software set the rate.  In our case the recording software effectively sets the same rate for both, which will not work.  Do not Monitor Recording or Change Playback Device (to ADL GT40 USB DAC).  While recording, it is okay to switch the GT40 source selector to Phono/Line if you want to monitor the source while recording (since Monitor Recording is off in VS).  There is an audible click when toggling the GT40 source but this is not transferred to the recording.  Toggle back to USB before "Split Tracks" or next recording.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on December 25, 2012, 07:07:58 pm
Hi,

The next version of VinylStudio (following on from V8.3.1) will offer a 'playback at 44/16' option regardless of recording settings or the file being worked on.  That should sort this issue out once and for all.  In the meantime, thanks for the tips.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: GregC on December 26, 2012, 04:13:13 am
I downloaded and purchased your software today.  It works very well with the Furutech ADL Esprit and Windows 7.  I did not have the same problems as the people reported with the GT40.

I look forward to when the software allows playback.  Another nice feature would be if you can select a block in the wavefrom and delete it. 

Will the new version be available for download to people who bought the current version?
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on December 26, 2012, 11:35:04 am
Hi,

You can delete the selected part of the waveform by using the 'Cut and Splice' facility in the Cleanup Audio window.  To remove gaps between tracks, shift-click and drag the green 'start pf track' marker past the section you want to remove.  You do this in the Split Tracks window.

The new version will be a free download, yes.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 10, 2013, 11:22:56 pm
Update: we now have a beta-test version of VinylStudio available which has a 'playback at 44/16' option.  Using this option should resolve the problems with the GT40.  Please let me know (by posting back here or through the website) if you would like a copy of this.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Shep on February 19, 2013, 11:58:21 pm
I've just registered after trying the trial version of VS with my GT 40 & experiencing the problems documented on this thread.
Can you please provide the beta version that addresses this problem so I can determine if I need to return the GT40?
Thanks for any assistance you can provide.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 20, 2013, 12:13:06 am
Hi,

You can download it from here:

Windows: http://www.alpinesoft.co.uk/VinylStudio/VSInstall.exe
Mac: http://www.alpinesoft.co.uk/VinylStudio/VinylStudio-Installer.dmg

You can select the 'Limit playback to 44kHz / 16 bit' option in VinylStudio's Change Playback Device dialog, accessible from the Record window.  On Vista and Windows 7, select also the 'Use WASAPI for playback' option in this dialog.

Please let us know how you get on.

Edit, 18Mar13: links updated to the latest version (V8.5.0).
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Shep on February 20, 2013, 12:42:08 am
Thanks for the quick reply...that's pretty impressive support at 1:15 a.m.!!

I'll let you know how it goes after it's up and running.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 20, 2013, 01:09:06 pm
OK, thanks.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Shep on February 20, 2013, 11:07:33 pm
Hey Paul,

Just wanted to report that I downloaded the linked version of VS and was able to activate the recording function with it @ AIFF 24/96. Unfortunately, that's as far as I got cuz my GT 40 has apparently failed and I'm not able to use it's USB input for play back.
Good on you for the excellent support and I hope to be using VS frequently when I'm back up and running.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 20, 2013, 11:20:07 pm
OK, well, thanks for trying.  Perhaps when you get a new unit you can report back.  TTFN.
Title: Re: Vinyl Studio hangs recording from ADL GT40 USB
Post by: Paul Sanders (AlpineSoft) on February 21, 2013, 08:10:34 am
Sorry, back again, there's one thing I need to check, just to be sure this isn't a software issue.  If you uncheck 'Limit playback to 44kHz / 16 bit' does your GT 40 come back to life?  I'm pretty sure it won't but I do need to check.  Also please uncheck 'Use WASAPI for playback' so that we are testing the same conditions as the old VinylStudio (V8.3.1) would use.  Thanks.